Lamleh versus Luneville



Mrs. Jane Reif
is an acknowledged authority on the Tibetan Terrier. She has been involved with the breed for many years. Mrs. Reif is also responsible for publishing several excellent books on the Tibetan Terrier including 'The Tibetan Terrier Book' and 'Reflections on the Tibetan Terrier'. She currently writes the Tibetan Terrier breed column in the AKC Gazette magazine.

This article was published in the late 1970's in the AKC Gazette and reprinted in the Canadian Tibetan Terrier Tidings newsletter. It deals with the subtle differences between Lamleh and Lunneville line Tibetan Terriers.

The Author's assertion is that a good Tibetan Terrier is a good Tibetan Terrier, regardless of the line of origin. The article is educational in that it attempts to deal with a complicated issue in response to this ages old question, posed by many new owners.

Things have become less clear in the ensuing 18 or so years since the article was originally published. However, this persepective from the late 1970's is interesting when comparing observations with the Tibetan Terriers we see today. It is also a very good information resource for new owners, with respect to understanding the beginnings of the breed.



Reprinted with kind permission from the Author - Jane Reif

A
new Tibetan Terrier owner, bubbling with enthusiasm, wrote me recently, Asking to "learn-everything about the breed". At the time I was up to my ears in whelping, breeding, club obligations, and that host of items that absorb our lives as breeder-exhibitors. But, one of the question asked by this nice gal from Texas was a familiar ones "Tell me the difference between the Lamleh and the Luneville lines ?"

I didn't have time then (don't have much more now), but I have been thinking about her questions while I watched new puppies et al. It is a question I have heard many times: I remember asking it myself. In many ways it is unanswerable for so little "pure" Lamleh and "pure" Luneville is being bred today, excluding Lehlam (formerly Lamleh) and Luneville in England, both still active and Kalai in this country, based on Lamleh, and carried on after Mrs. Murphy's death by young Ms. Tyrell.

The majority of all other Tibetan Terrier lines or strains are the result of outcrosses between the two lines. After these initial outcrosses, breeders seemed to swing heavily toward one line or the other, based on what they perceived the breed to be.

To understand all this, one must go back to the original lines starting with the Lamleh Kennel of Dr. A.R.H. Greig in England (Latmah and Ladkok being the names of her mother's and sister's companion kennels). These foundation Tibetan Terriers were brought in, primarily by "Nancy" Greig from northern India and directly from Tibet. Starting fairly early in the game (one must remember that Dr. Greig came from a "doggy" tradition), she developed several important strains within her own evolving Lamleh line, but the earliest dogs had certain strong characteristics in common: a square, sturdy look, double shaggy coat, high-set profuse tail, large, flat feet, a rather natural canine head, and what appeared to be low hocks. Most of them were gold or golden and white, although later so called parti-colors appeared as well as some tri colors and blacks.

As she went along it did appear (again judging from early photographs) that Dr. Greig refined her type slightly. The dogs of the post war era did not always have the bold look of the early dogs. And, one can trace her type by looking at photographs chronologically, Jana of Lamleh, a Crufts winner of 1939, was a more "sophisticated" Tibetan than was "Bunti", Dr. Greig's first.

About 1960, Connie and John Downey of Luneville fame bred their Tibetan bitch, Luneville Lady Penelope, to Ch. Kala Kah of Lamleh (a rare black of Dr. Greig's), producing the famed stud dog, Eng. Ch. Luneville Prince Khan This was to change the breed in profound ways.

Lady Penelope was the daughter of Ch. Trojan Kynos, the F.P.U. (Further Particulars Unknown) dog found on the docks by John Downey and verified as a TT by the Kennel Club. The Downeys' Ch. Princess Aureus was, in turn, the daughter of Princess Chan, another F.P.U. Tibetan, and of Ch. Pa San g of Lamleh owned by Dr. Greig.

After the breeding of Kala Kah to Penelope, Dr. Greig fought the Downeys and Luneville with both increasing ardor and bitterness, claiming the dogs were "impure". She sold her stock to Germany, Switzerland, Sweden, the Unite States- but no longer to English breeders. The Downeys continued to inbreed on their own stock and to set their "type" firmly in the breed. Their dogs were presented in the ring nicely groomed thus attracting a good deal of attention often denied Dr. Greig's Lamlehs.

Yet this unfortunate turn of events proved to be a boon to the United States for Dr. Greig sent excellent stock to Dr. and Mrs. Murphy who founded "Kalai" in 1957. In essence, England's loss was our gain. It was on this Lamleh stock sent her that Mrs. Murphy put her own personal stamp, so that today, Kalai is really a line of its own, based on Lamleh.

Now, how are they different, how alike? In our Standard a great deal of emphasis has been put on "head", and rightly so. To my eye (and not my ear) the Lamleh, Kalai, and Luneville heads differ. In Kalai and Lamleh, the proportion is one-to-one with the eyes (eye set) equidistant from the nose leather to the centre of the skull, forming a square.

The difference between Lamleh and Kalai is very slight, but the Kalai head is a tiny more wedge-shaped. The nose leather on Lamleh is bigger, stronger looking, the head a bit bolder, yet holding the same shape. The Luneville head, to me, is slightly more rectangular, and the eyes are set closer together (not close, just closer). The skull and muzzle lean to wards the Beardie look at times, occasionally with a hint of romanizing on the muzzle. However, it is important to point out that a GOOD Tibetan head of these lines more closely resembles a GOOD tibetan head of the other two. In other words, excellence falls within true type. (Even with minor variations, it is the same theme).

In addition to the head variations, there are others. Early on, the Shahi-Taj line of Bill Walsh was forged out of an outcrossing of Kalai and Luneville. Since Walsh was a professional breeder, his influence was felt strongly. And while today, many of the breeders who started with Shahi-Taj stock lean strongly one way or the other to either of the founding lines, most of them have chosen Luneville. Here we find a distillation of the English Luneville that is hard to put into words, but is there nevertheless.

Many of these dogs do not have the depth of brisket and the rounded loin of the "pure" Luneville dogs. They mature rather early, carry beautiful coats lovely temperament, have a tendency to smaller feet and straighter angulation in the rear. They are very often quite small and have a tendency to "elongate in proportion (carrying the slightly shorter leg) and to have too long a neck.

While Kalai is more sophisticated (more polished?) in looks than early Lamleh, it does retain that "survivor" look found in special breeds. The good Saluki, for example, has it, the near perfect expression of form following function. So, most Kalai dogs look as if they could survive. There is a "presence" about the good ones. Physically, I have found the Kalai dogs vary quite a bit. They range wider in size than the Luneville or Luneville based lines, and they mature very late. My foundation bitch is a "pure" Kalai, granddaughter of Shanak. While she is of moderate size (14-3/4") her "fighting" mature weight is 25 pounds. Even weighing 28-29 pounds in full pregnancy, her centre of gravity does not change much; she looks and acts about the same. She possesses a lovely loin, a powerful body, great depth of brisket and a strong, well muscled neckline, but true to Kalai, not always. At 12 months even at 18 months, she was a leggy, boney, elbowy youngster weighing a mere 18 pounds. She happens to be my personal example of the later maturing qualities of the Kalai line. She also represents two strains within the five Dr. Greig told me she sent to this country. Other Kalai Tibetans are light in bone, a bit rangier in look. But regardless of these variances, one must have more patience to deal with Kalai and Lamleh, but then one must have equal patience with fine wine.

Coat variance in Kalai is wide also, ranging from the near straight to very heavy undulation (nearly curly). All of these carry heavy undercoat.

Also characteristic of Kalai are large, flat feet; low hocks; and, slightly wider rears and fronts. A flaw in the line is the tendency to over angulation ion, just as a flaw in Luneville is the tendency to straight stifles.

In order to fully compare the two lines (and their strains) I suppose one would have to put dogs together in terms of developmental age rather than chronological. It might mean something as farfetched as comparing an eight month old puppy with a three year old.

From my point of view (and we are all subjective) I prefer to stand in the middle. I admire the coats, temperaments, high tail sets, and strong bodies of the English Lunevilles. Equally so, I wish to retain the classic Lamleh head, proportions and "look"; the large feet (set in Kalai so well); and the strong rears of that line. I do not mind waiting the-extra year or two for maturity. A slow maturing Tibetan has great advantages (even if judges do not always agree). Devotees of each line are very strong minded in Tibetans, perhaps more so than in any other breed, so to try for the middle is sometimes difficult. I would like to point out one last thing. GOOD Tibetans, regardless of line, have far more in common than they have differences.

To look at a picture of Int. and Nordic Ch. Chamar's' Chamar, bred by Anniette Ljoner-Larrson in Sweden, of pure, old Lamleh stock and to look at another dog, English-bred, now living in Germany, Int. Eng. Ger. Ch. Willowbrae Willow, pure Luneville, a son of Eng. Ch. Luneville Prince Khan, is to look at two mature Tibetan Terrier males who might well be litter brothers. When it comes to excellence, we may not be as far apart as we think we are?


| Index |